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Post by oldmontana on Jul 27, 2018 16:11:50 GMT -5
Again.. Back to the topic of my thread...do you want do do away with ICE? If so why? I asked a question and you did not answer it because? Name calling is not a answer. Have a good day! You should do two things: You should read your own posts so as to have some idea as to what is going on in your thread. and please quit with the accusations you typically use("name calling") in trying to portray yourself as the injured party.
So, let's take a look at your original post: Kirsten Gillibrand: Abolishing ICE is the 'first thing' Democrats should do if they win control of Congress www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/kirsten-gillibrand-abolishing-ice-is-the-first-thing-democra... One of the top items on Democrats’ agenda if they win control of the House and Senate in November should be to abolish Immigration and Customs Enforcement, Sen. Kirsten Gillibrand, D-N.Y., said Sunday. “When we flip the House and flip the Senate, I think the first thing we should do is deal with the children who are being separated from their families at the border. I think we should get rid of ICE,” Gillibrand said during a panel at Ozy Fest in New York City. Gillibrand is one of several Democrats who are advocating for an end to ICE following backlash over the separation of children from their parents at the U.S.-Mexico border and immigration raids conducted by federal immigration officials under the Trump administration. As a growing number of Democrats have joined the calls for ICE to be abolished, Rep. Mark Pocan, D-Wis., introduced legislation this month aimed at doing just that. During the event Sunday, Gillibrand said she believes there should be two missions for the nation’s immigration policy: a national security mission and humanitarian mission. ============================================= Democrats have lost touch with reality. What a stupid idea! Democrats ...the party of open borders? You picked a rather obscure news story in an attempt to portray the Democratic Party as a whole, as being in favor of abolishing ICE, like it's really going to be part of their platform in upcoming elections. This Senator from New York, Sen. Kirsten Gillibrand made this comment during a discussion at an entertainment event called Ozy Fest.
Quite frankly, I've never heard of Sen. Kirsten Gillibrand , Ozy Fest or the idea that ICE "should be" abolished, until of course after having read this thread.
I don't see any other, more high profile democrats(like Nancy Pelosi, Dianne Feinstein, Maxine Waters, for example) standing on the steps in front of Congress or on TV news programs proclaiming the desirability of doing away with ICE.
Not to mention: you had not asked anyone's opinion in this post, you just inserted your little talking point that:
...that you were spoon fed and had picked up on some Fox & Friends broadcast, no doubt.
BUT, later on in the thread you claim[falsely] that you "asked" but did not get an answer, so as a gesture of good will I will humor you and give you my opinion:
The senator was addressing a young, hip audience at the OZY FEST event and threw that comment out, in order to connect with what may well be her constituency....much the same
way that Trump connects with the audience at his hate rallies, you know- a little subtle racist or facist comment to get the followers primed.
The Democrats are no more going to try to abolish ICE than the Republicans would try to abolish Medicare and Social Security....although the Repub's will be looking for ways to cut and reduce recipients earned benefits.
ICE as an organization is not the problem, the problem is the Administration that directs and orders ICE to take actions. Once Trump and his administration is gone, ICE will continue to pursue its mission in the professional manner that it typically had, in the past.
Ever hear of Elizabeth Warren? These Democrats want to abolish ICE by Daniel Chaitin | July 01, 2018 08:23 PM | Updated Jul 01, 2018, 09:34 PM Print this article warren "We need to rebuild our immigration system from top to bottom by starting with replacing ICE with something that reflects our morality," said Sen. Elizabeth Warren. AP Photo A growing number of Democrats are calling for the U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement agency to be abolished, which has coincided with fierce opposition to the Trump administration's "zero tolerance" immigration policy. President Trump has said the Democrats will be "beaten so badly" if they campaign on a platform of dismantling ICE, but some in the party see it as an effective rallying call. Here is of Democrats who have said they would like to see the demise of the agency: Sen. Elizabeth Warren: The Massachusetts senator and liberal fixture said Saturday at a rally in Boston: "We need to rebuild our immigration system from top to bottom by starting with replacing ICE with something that reflects our morality." Sen. Kirsten Gillibrand, D-N.Y.: Like Warren, she is a potential 2020 contender. Gillibrand decried ICE as a "deportation force" -- a reference to child separation at the border that Trump officials have criticized as being inaccurately pinned on ICE. She told CNN she would like to get "rid of it, start over, reimagine it and build something that actually works." Rep. Mark Pocan, D-Wis.: The chair of the Congressional Progressive Caucus is working on legislation to eliminate ICE. Reps. Pramila Jayapal, D-Wash., Earl Blumenauer, D-Ore., Jim McGovern, D-Mass., Raul Grijalva, D-Ariz., and Mike Capuano, D-Mass., have indicated they would support such a bill, according to Vox. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez: The 28-year-old self-declared socialist who defeated fourth-ranking House Democrat Joe Crowley of New York last week. She ran on a platform that includes abolishing ICE. New York City Mayor Bill de Blasio: “ICE’s time has come and gone,” the mayor said in a radio interview on Friday. Cynthia Nixon: The actress-turned-Democratic candidate for New York governor has called ICE a"terrorist organization" that should be abolished. Randy Bryce. This labor organizer who is vying to take retiring House Speaker Paul Ryan's seat in Wisconsin's First Congressional District encouraged his Twitter followers in April to sign their support for abolishing ICE. 50/50: Sen. Kamala Harris, D-Calif., hasn't gone so far as to call for abolishing ICE, but did say last week that ICE should be reassessed "from scratch." Meanwhile, some Democrats on Saturday cautioned against the efficacy of abolishing ICE. Sen. Tammy Duckworth, D-Ill., said on CNN that even if ICE is taken apart, the same "failed" policies will remain. There are “a lot of things we could do” before making the move to replace the agency entirely, she said. Sen. Amy Klobuchar, D-Minn., echoed that sentiment. “I think what has to change are the policies. And the people who are making these policies are making horrendous decisions like separating kids from their parents. We are always going to need immigration enforcement,” Klobuchar said on ABC's "This Week." “We are a major country with major borders. To me, it’s ‘What are those policies?’” ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- And Ms Warren is the leading contender to be the Democrats Presidential candidate in 2020. I am so glad that I do not belong to a political party!
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Post by Drifter on Jul 27, 2018 16:35:41 GMT -5
And Ms Warren is the leading contender to be the Democrats Presidential candidate in 2020. Please post a link to that. I'd like to read it.
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Post by oldmontana on Jul 27, 2018 16:39:37 GMT -5
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Post by Drifter on Jul 27, 2018 16:44:53 GMT -5
Thanks oldmontana. However, I'm not seeing in that article where Warden is a lead contender for the 2020 Presidential election.
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Post by tnthomas on Jul 27, 2018 16:58:23 GMT -5
Ever hear of Elizabeth Warren? "We need to rebuild our immigration system from top to bottom by starting with replacing ICE with something that reflects our morality," said Sen. Elizabeth Warren. A growing number of Democrats are calling for the U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement agency to be abolished, which has coincided with fierce opposition to the Trump administration's "zero tolerance" immigration policy. President Trump has said the Democrats will be "beaten so badly" if they campaign on a platform of dismantling ICE, but some in the party see it as an effective rallying call. Here is of Democrats who have said they would like to see the demise of the agency: Sen. Elizabeth Warren: The Massachusetts senator and liberal fixture said Saturday at a rally in Boston: "We need to rebuild our immigration system from top to bottom by starting with replacing ICE with something that reflects our morality." Sen. Kirsten Gillibrand, D-N.Y.: Like Warren, she is a potential 2020 contender. Gillibrand decried ICE as a "deportation force" -- a reference to child separation at the border that Trump officials have criticized as being inaccurately pinned on ICE. She told CNN she would like to get "rid of it, start over, reimagine it and build something that actually works." Rep. Mark Pocan, D-Wis.: The chair of the Congressional Progressive Caucus is working on legislation to eliminate ICE. Reps. Pramila Jayapal, D-Wash., Earl Blumenauer, D-Ore., Jim McGovern, D-Mass., Raul Grijalva, D-Ariz., and Mike Capuano, D-Mass., have indicated they would support such a bill, according to Vox. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez: The 28-year-old self-declared socialist who defeated fourth-ranking House Democrat Joe Crowley of New York last week. She ran on a platform that includes abolishing ICE. New York City Mayor Bill de Blasio: “ICE’s time has come and gone,” the mayor said in a radio interview on Friday. Cynthia Nixon: The actress-turned-Democratic candidate for New York governor has called ICE a"terrorist organization" that should be abolished. Randy Bryce. This labor organizer who is vying to take retiring House Speaker Paul Ryan's seat in Wisconsin's First Congressional District encouraged his Twitter followers in April to sign their support for abolishing ICE. 50/50: Sen. Kamala Harris, D-Calif., hasn't gone so far as to call for abolishing ICE, but did say last week that ICE should be reassessed "from scratch." Meanwhile, some Democrats on Saturday cautioned against the efficacy of abolishing ICE. Sen. Tammy Duckworth, D-Ill., said on CNN that even if ICE is taken apart, the same "failed" policies will remain. There are “a lot of things we could do” before making the move to replace the agency entirely, she said. Sen. Amy Klobuchar, D-Minn., echoed that sentiment. “I think what has to change are the policies. And the people who are making these policies are making horrendous decisions like separating kids from their parents. We are always going to need immigration enforcement,” Klobuchar said on ABC's "This Week." “We are a major country with major borders. To me, it’s ‘What are those policies?’” ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- And Ms Warren is the leading contender to be the Democrats Presidential candidate in 2020. I am so glad that I do not belong to a political party! Alright Mr. oldmontana , now you have a post that is informative, somewhat accurate and fit for discussion. I would have to say that at this point all the talk of abolishing ICE is just "sound-bytes" being thrown out to the public, for consideration. Of course, unless there was a massive sweep of Congressional seats by the Dems in 2018 all the talk about ICE will be moot.
Clearly, this idea isn't universal amongst Democratic lawmakers, and the more likely scenario would be to 'overhaul' ICE, something that has happened before to the agency, going from INS to ICE. Many agencies get streamlined, updated or even re-purposed periodically, nothing sensational to write home about.
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Post by tnthomas on Jul 27, 2018 17:08:28 GMT -5
I am so glad that I do not belong to a political party! Well, I am happy for you. Are you saying that you re-registered as "no party affiliation"? A lot of states won't let you vote in the primaries if you're not affiliated. In 2004 I gave up my Republican party affiliation of 24 years, the GOP was getting so obviously shifted to the extreme Right, I could no longer support a party that clearly did not have my working class interests at heart. However, just last year I decided that I needed to make a statement and commit to a party that does believe in the strength of
America's middle class, so I re-registered and declared my party affiliation as Democrat.
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Post by chinadoll1981 on Jul 27, 2018 17:32:54 GMT -5
How about we just go back to the INS and actually enforce the laws without being inhumane. Unless Dems want a free pass. In that case get rid of homeland security all together. Screw it. Let anyone in, no matter their motive and let the pieces fall were they may. Just don't dare complain about IED's and suicide bombers. Call it the new world order. Suicide bombers??? from Catholic Countries (primarily) I really no think so.... IED's from Tijuana?? I also not think so... Perhaps you may have no drank the kool-aid but maybe take a few sips???
Trump and his Right Wing fans all think that MS13 are coming by the thousands.... not really....are they coming illegally?? sure... so are other countries but.... the border issue was about parents fleeing danger in own countries.... not bringing IED's in backpacks.... I am immigrant... I was allowed to become citizen I was not fleeing my country of origin... I just wanted to be American.... and so these people too.... you can argue fact they should have went to entry port or whatever nonsense... but bottom line... most of them flee for reasons of desperation. If you cross Rio Grande.... you no stop and think Okay I have to go to San Diego.... and many who seeking asylum.... children were separated from them too.... so Administration were total liars..... all should be jailed.... this was human rights violation... People talk about Bush being war criminal.... Trump is a humanitarian rights criminal who should be thrown out of office and prosecuted. And again.... despite people saying they just need change.... I feel ICE overstepped it's mission and is very much a maligned agency which needs to be taken down.... and replaced with something more sane....
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Post by tnthomas on Jul 27, 2018 17:47:39 GMT -5
The people coming over the border from Mexico are overwhelmingly Mexican nationals looking to get a job so they can feed their families. Without a doubt, there are be some with criminal intent, but eventually they get arrested, and get deported, once they complete their jail or prison sentence.
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Post by smitty45 on Jul 27, 2018 19:17:51 GMT -5
How about we just go back to the INS and actually enforce the laws without being inhumane. Unless Dems want a free pass. In that case get rid of homeland security all together. Screw it. Let anyone in, no matter their motive and let the pieces fall were they may. Just don't dare complain about IED's and suicide bombers. Call it the new world order. Suicide bombers??? from Catholic Countries (primarily) I really no think so.... IED's from Tijuana?? I also not think so... Perhaps you may have no drank the kool-aid but maybe take a few sips???
Trump and his Right Wing fans all think that MS13 are coming by the thousands.... not really....are they coming illegally?? sure... so are other countries but.... the border issue was about parents fleeing danger in own countries.... not bringing IED's in backpacks.... I am immigrant... I was allowed to become citizen I was not fleeing my country of origin... I just wanted to be American.... and so these people too.... you can argue fact they should have went to entry port or whatever nonsense... but bottom line... most of them flee for reasons of desperation. If you cross Rio Grande.... you no stop and think Okay I have to go to San Diego.... and many who seeking asylum.... children were separated from them too.... so Administration were total liars..... all should be jailed.... this was human rights violation... People talk about Bush being war criminal.... Trump is a humanitarian rights criminal who should be thrown out of office and prosecuted. And again.... despite people saying they just need change.... I feel ICE overstepped it's mission and is very much a maligned agency which needs to be taken down.... and replaced with something more sane.... I didn;t mean Mexicans or other countries in Central America are going to be terrorist,, I;m just saying if we have a open border, why have any immigration laws. Just have a free for all and let the pieces fall where they may. Trump complains about MS13 , but where is the outcry for the Cryps and the Bloods, and other American gangs? no where, never has been, never will. I do agree ICE overstepped it;s mission,, but they didn;t separate children form parents just because they wanted to,, they were told to do so.
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Post by chinadoll1981 on Jul 27, 2018 21:10:43 GMT -5
Suicide bombers??? from Catholic Countries (primarily) I really no think so.... IED's from Tijuana?? I also not think so... Perhaps you may have no drank the kool-aid but maybe take a few sips???
Trump and his Right Wing fans all think that MS13 are coming by the thousands.... not really....are they coming illegally?? sure... so are other countries but.... the border issue was about parents fleeing danger in own countries.... not bringing IED's in backpacks.... I am immigrant... I was allowed to become citizen I was not fleeing my country of origin... I just wanted to be American.... and so these people too.... you can argue fact they should have went to entry port or whatever nonsense... but bottom line... most of them flee for reasons of desperation. If you cross Rio Grande.... you no stop and think Okay I have to go to San Diego.... and many who seeking asylum.... children were separated from them too.... so Administration were total liars..... all should be jailed.... this was human rights violation... People talk about Bush being war criminal.... Trump is a humanitarian rights criminal who should be thrown out of office and prosecuted. And again.... despite people saying they just need change.... I feel ICE overstepped it's mission and is very much a maligned agency which needs to be taken down.... and replaced with something more sane.... I didn;t mean Mexicans or other countries in Central America are going to be terrorist,, I;m just saying if we have a open border, why have any immigration laws. Just have a free for all and let the pieces fall where they may. Trump complains about MS13 , but where is the outcry for the Cryps and the Bloods, and other American gangs? no where, never has been, never will. I do agree ICE overstepped it;s mission,, but they didn;t separate children form parents just because they wanted to,, they were told to do so. see??? you sipping on the Kool-Aid again.... no one say Democrats want open borders.... NO ONE except Foolish Donkey... he say enough time, people believe No I not say THEY (ICE) did on own.... yes they were ordered.... so was the Wehrmacht....the Schutzstaffel, Einsatzgruppen..... read history..... they all when light shined on them..... pleaded that "We were only following orders" Ask Dr. "Newbie" how she feels....her own people..... family.... all caught up in the insanity of Hitler...... many things appear to be repeating.....
"Pay no attention to what you see read and hear.... listen only to me" Trump
What good fortune for governments that the people do not think. Adolf Hitler
Make the lie big, make it simple, keep saying it, and eventually they will believe it. Adolf Hitler
finally...... “It is the press, above all, which wages a positively fanatical and slanderous struggle, tearing down everything which can be regarded as a support of national independence, cultural elevation, and the economic independence of the nation.” Adolf Hitler
scary isn't it??
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