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Post by notbob on Nov 15, 2022 17:16:18 GMT -5
In 2018, 2020, and 2022, the MAGA crowd has called into question the integrity of our elections. Numerous court cases lost by Republican challenges proved there was no voter fraud. Many of those cases were thrown out before they ever got started because the grounds were baseless. Most of us here at Take Refuge already know that.
Despite Republicans trying to lie and cheat their way into office, and offering no plan for American voters, there is still considerable support for Republicans. One such antagonist who posts here (who will remain nameless because this post isn't intended to antagonize him) is someone who still supports them. He may find some tidbit of information he feels is his "gotcha" moment, and he'll create a post with it, or he'll comment on other people's posts that more often than not, have nothing to do with the original post. It's the old, "yeah, but look over there" method of deflecting away from something he has no rebuttal for.
On a recent post, I had enough of his BS and told him to either stick to the post or shut up. It was probably as harsh as I've been with him. Whenever any of us have taken him to task in the past, he'll come up with a whiny excuse - something like, "I thought this was a place for exchanging ideas." I would agree with his excuse except for his deflective means and the fact that much of what he provides is truly "fake news" from sources with questionable credibility.
As far as I'm concerned, I can no longer give any Republicans the benefit of the doubt. Republican politicians have almost unanimously supported Trump. That means they're perfectly willing to lie and cheat their way into office, and they can't be trusted to have the people's best interests at heart. That also means, Republican voters support lying and cheating to get their way. If I get into a discussion with Republicans on a forum or social media site, I'll do my best to stay within the rules, but I already know I can't trust them. I will do my best to help them understand how they're wrong, but if they continue with their BS, outside of prescribed constraints, the gloves are off.
Am I wrong to take a firm stand against those I believe are liars and cheaters?
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Post by tnthomas on Nov 15, 2022 17:59:59 GMT -5
Am I wrong to take a firm stand against those I believe are liars and cheaters? As a Democrat, I have compassion, even for the grossly ignorant and misguided. But redemption is a personal thing that the affected individual has to pursue with their own resources... Recalling Hilter's Germany, certainly their were millions that know what was going on, but perhaps felt powerless to stand up against the regime. Maybe that's the case, today in the U.S., FEAR.
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Post by helen on Nov 15, 2022 18:02:42 GMT -5
This is America where everyone is entitled to choose their own hero. It must be embarrassing when the one you've chosen turns out to be a fool.
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Post by Drifter on Nov 15, 2022 18:29:27 GMT -5
Am I wrong to take a firm stand against those I believe are liars and cheaters? Nothing wrong in taking a stand, but know you don't have the power to change another's behavior. If a person doesn't want to stop lying, there's absolutely nothing you can do about that. That's why they say, "choose your battles wisely."
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Post by notbob on Nov 16, 2022 0:29:05 GMT -5
In my opinion, when we don't take a stand, it continues. What they stand for, their talk, their manipulative tactics, their lies, and the fact that they've made Liberals the enemy while offering nothing of their own to take care of the masses has to stop. I don't know...maybe things will work out naturally. They're beginning to eat their own. It's getting really ugly on that side of the aisle. Are their supporters unhappy with the infighting, or are they enjoying it? Over the past six years, they must've loved the drama. Many of them are still loyal, but now they have to choose sides within their own ranks. Get the popcorn, I guess. I do think we need to stop putting up with their BS though.
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Post by helen on Nov 16, 2022 9:29:35 GMT -5
The Trump Cult has made it very difficult to be a 'good' Republican and it's hard to be something else if you've been one all your life. Being more inclusive might raise membership and provide more intelligent conversation. Just my 2 cents worth.
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Post by notbob on Nov 16, 2022 10:07:34 GMT -5
The Trump Cult has made it very difficult to be a 'good' Republican and it's hard to be something else if you've been one all your life. Being more inclusive might raise membership and provide more intelligent conversation. Just my 2 cents worth. There's no such thing as a "good Republican." Attachments:
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Post by helen on Nov 16, 2022 14:25:36 GMT -5
I was 11 years old when Franklin D. Roosevelt died so I have voted in lots of elections and always for the person I thought the most qualified or, in some cases, the one that I thought would be the least harmful. Dwight Eisenhower was a decent man and also a Republican as was Gerald Ford.
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Post by oldmontana on Nov 16, 2022 17:19:51 GMT -5
In 2018, 2020, and 2022, the MAGA crowd has called into question the integrity of our elections. Numerous court cases lost by Republican challenges proved there was no voter fraud. Many of those cases were thrown out before they ever got started because the grounds were baseless. Most of us here at Take Refuge already know that. Despite Republicans trying to lie and cheat their way into office, and offering no plan for American voters, there is still considerable support for Republicans. One such antagonist who posts here (who will remain nameless because this post isn't intended to antagonize him) is someone who still supports them. He may find some tidbit of information he feels is his "gotcha" moment, and he'll create a post with it, or he'll comment on other people's posts that more often than not, have nothing to do with the original post. It's the old, "yeah, but look over there" method of deflecting away from something he has no rebuttal for. On a recent post, I had enough of his BS and told him to either stick to the post or shut up. It was probably as harsh as I've been with him. Whenever any of us have taken him to task in the past, he'll come up with a whiny excuse - something like, "I thought this was a place for exchanging ideas." I would agree with his excuse except for his deflective means and the fact that much of what he provides is truly "fake news" from sources with questionable credibility. As far as I'm concerned, I can no longer give any Republicans the benefit of the doubt. Republican politicians have almost unanimously supported Trump. That means they're perfectly willing to lie and cheat their way into office, and they can't be trusted to have the people's best interests at heart. That also means, Republican voters support lying and cheating to get their way. If I get into a discussion with Republicans on a forum or social media site, I'll do my best to stay within the rules, but I already know I can't trust them. I will do my best to help them understand how they're wrong, but if they continue with their BS, outside of prescribed constraints, the gloves are off. Am I wrong to take a firm stand against those I believe are liars and cheaters? There is something wrong when we have states like CA, NV and AZ where we do not know the winners of their elections. In FL we got the results in like 4 hours.
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Post by oldmontana on Nov 16, 2022 17:26:21 GMT -5
The Trump Cult has made it very difficult to be a 'good' Republican and it's hard to be something else if you've been one all your life. Being more inclusive might raise membership and provide more intelligent conversation. Just my 2 cents worth. There's no such thing as a "good Republican." "There's no such thing as a "good Republican."" Saying that says a lot about your ability to be objective in my opinion.
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Post by tnthomas on Nov 16, 2022 18:10:31 GMT -5
There is something wrong when we have states like CA, NV and AZ where we do not know the winners of their elections. In FL we got the results in like 4 hours. Nothing wrong with the normal workings of the world, maybe in the way you see it.
You know what's really wrong? This statement sums it up accurately:
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Post by notbob on Nov 17, 2022 0:42:55 GMT -5
The Trump Cult has made it very difficult to be a 'good' Republican and it's hard to be something else if you've been one all your life. Being more inclusive might raise membership and provide more intelligent conversation. Just my 2 cents worth. helen, if you're a Republican, I wasn't aiming barbs at you. The Republican party today, is nothing like it used to be. The Republican party has always been pro corporations, but it at least recognized the needs of the masses. Citizens United and the Trump ilk has taken that pro corporation stance to a whole new level, and they don't even care if any of it trickles down. I used to be a Republican, but I went kicking and screaming against the party when I voted for John Kerry against Dubbya - my first Democratic vote for president. I was pissed. WMDs my a$$.
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Post by notbob on Nov 17, 2022 0:43:57 GMT -5
There's no such thing as a "good Republican." "There's no such thing as a "good Republican."" Saying that says a lot about your ability to be objective in my opinion. Then you didn't look at the corresponding graphics.
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Post by notbob on Nov 17, 2022 0:48:25 GMT -5
In 2018, 2020, and 2022, the MAGA crowd has called into question the integrity of our elections. Numerous court cases lost by Republican challenges proved there was no voter fraud. Many of those cases were thrown out before they ever got started because the grounds were baseless. Most of us here at Take Refuge already know that. Despite Republicans trying to lie and cheat their way into office, and offering no plan for American voters, there is still considerable support for Republicans. One such antagonist who posts here (who will remain nameless because this post isn't intended to antagonize him) is someone who still supports them. He may find some tidbit of information he feels is his "gotcha" moment, and he'll create a post with it, or he'll comment on other people's posts that more often than not, have nothing to do with the original post. It's the old, "yeah, but look over there" method of deflecting away from something he has no rebuttal for. On a recent post, I had enough of his BS and told him to either stick to the post or shut up. It was probably as harsh as I've been with him. Whenever any of us have taken him to task in the past, he'll come up with a whiny excuse - something like, "I thought this was a place for exchanging ideas." I would agree with his excuse except for his deflective means and the fact that much of what he provides is truly "fake news" from sources with questionable credibility. As far as I'm concerned, I can no longer give any Republicans the benefit of the doubt. Republican politicians have almost unanimously supported Trump. That means they're perfectly willing to lie and cheat their way into office, and they can't be trusted to have the people's best interests at heart. That also means, Republican voters support lying and cheating to get their way. If I get into a discussion with Republicans on a forum or social media site, I'll do my best to stay within the rules, but I already know I can't trust them. I will do my best to help them understand how they're wrong, but if they continue with their BS, outside of prescribed constraints, the gloves are off. Am I wrong to take a firm stand against those I believe are liars and cheaters? There is something wrong when we have states like CA, NV and AZ where we do not know the winners of their elections. In FL we got the results in like 4 hours. Yep, they do things a little differently, but did they do anything wrong? That's what some losers are saying. Where's your proof oldmontana? You always ask me for proof. Where's yours?
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Post by helen on Nov 17, 2022 10:17:48 GMT -5
I am a registered Democrat, notbob, but at heart I'm an Independent. However, I live in a "primary" state so unless I declare a party allegiance, I'm denied a vote in primary elections (the little and often ignored ones) and that is where some of the most important votes lie. I hate that Republican policies in the past 20+ years have gradually pushed me into the 'no one with an (R) behind their name gets my vote' category but that's where I now stand.
Voters need decent choices and Congress needs to learn how to compromise to get things done.
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